This was where he first got a taste for cutlery, which would later shape the man he became and the company he launched. The post-1962 knives were produced by the Camillus Cutlery Company and Milpar during the Vietnam Era. The 1954 update calls for the knife to have a sharpened clip point blade and an additional rivet to the sheath. 1200 dozen made in At a time like this, when not all dealers can be trusted, you need to be on guard. This is usually where I first look at when dating knives. This knife looks a lot I appreciate the vote of confidence . head pommel. I have never seen that variation. Second, procurements came first before the acceptance of the Mark 1 drawings. It doesn't sit flush my guess is it was replaced. oldjunkagain. Im not a fan of social media and dont use it. HiI'm new to the site and am trying to identify a knife my daughter found yesterday. Valor is the name of the US company that retailed the 998. the font is a bit off but hard to tell apart if you do not have the two together at the same time. The U.S. Defense Department published to private industry requirements for a standardized fixed blade knife to issue to pilots and aircrews of the various service branches. Some had been made before the time, and they dont have the exact specs as above. The latest dated pommel stamped Camillus 5733 is 3-1985. These bayonets are very similar to the originals so you need to check By Currently, the military-grade Air Force Survival Knife is only manufactured and sold by the Ontario Knife Company. The blade design is different then the Hi John, Ontarios knife became procured by the U.S. Army and was issued a National Stock Number, NSN: 1095-01-530-0833 within the Federal Supply System. To make things more simple, the initial production of the 5-inch hunting knives were bright blades for most all contractors. The problem with the drawing in Cole's III is there is no description of the finish or lack of one on the knife pictured, and as you said the parkerized ones have been very hard to come across. repro has a very short and sharply curved false edge. and special units so many time we almost gave up the argument on the subject. That stamp is different than the one used earlier. Skip, I'm not sure that we can or can not label either of those knives as genuine Mark 1's. Thanks, Dwain. Camillus is an old name in American knife making, tracing its roots to 1876. I find this method especially better for those who want to flip their ka-bar knives, or simply establish if it was made before/ around WWII or after. 43 knives in total, all from the showroom. This blog was how do you say it? by Colonel666 Sun May 26, 2013 1:43 am, Post And after the war, they apparently were interested in fulfilling the new post-war military scout knife specification, MIL-K-818, and . Your guidelines seem to contradict themselves:The knife has a thin, pinned pommelWW2 knife pommels are peened on the knife, not pinnedWhich is it: they are pinned or they are not?Please let me know, than you. As such, finding a definitive history of the development and procurement of this knife is difficult to reconstruct. The Newer one is by Camillus the older one I got given to by my uncle, who got it from someone in Vietnam. Even if the Ontario Knife Company discontinues their production and the DoD phases them out of their inventories, the knife will be around for commercial purchase. They may allow you to send it to them to get refurbished. In 1962, the knife was modified by reducing the blade to 5" in length. I would love to see a picture of the knife. https://prc68.com/I/OneManLifeRaft.html#Knife. The Camillus Cutlery company also produced: Their production capacity was expanded during the second world war when they had to manufacture a lot of high-quality knives to meet the needs of the soldiers shipping off to war. When WWI and WWII came along, Adolph shifted the focus of the company to cater to U.S. soldiers and the Allied Forces. steel domed rivets. Besides showing you how to date a Camillus knife properly, I also give some tips to avoid falling into the fake vintage Camillus knife scam. I was wondering if you had run across anything about the dates on the pommel nut. I attach a photo of the peened pommel that makes this 6" a 1960 model: Hi. As such, this knife was not intended as a frontiersman or bushcraft knife, per se. Each manufacturer would like to put its spin on things. The one on the left there is a bevel at the top of the grip. surely wasn't in Vietnam unless it was with a tourist. The bit telltale difference is the sharpened false edge. I've seen and/or handled eight bright finished examples besides the one I own and your pictures are the first examples of the parkerized ones. Consequently, the knife blade being reduced from six inches to five inches allowed it to retain some of the qualities necessary to carry out survival tasks, but small enough that it could be easily stowed on an aircrewmans vest without causing interference for aircrews trying to carry out their duties while flying. Made for Sears & Roebucks. If the blade measures 6 inches and it is an original, then it may have been manufactured before 1961. Its width is 21.8mm (21.8mm) and thickness is 4.5mm (4.5mm). Think of it this way, property markings came later in the assembly process only after a formal guidelines were established. This happens quite often. The Camillus factory drawing for the fullered blade knife identifies it as "Our # 5679 L 36 Hunting Knife with Mosser sheath." The tang stamp on this knife is post Government contract era. You ought to take part in a contest for one of the best sites on the net. It is marked just U.S.N. Co., Olean N.Y.Straight lineNilFrom 1909Union Cut. Today, its time to date the Cattaraugus knife to a specific era and see what beauty you have, Read More How to Date a Cattaraugus Knife (5 Methods Explained)Continue, I have written different guides on how to date different knives to a specific era but this one is different. However, the business was bought by the Brown family in 1902, who then moved the company out to Olean NY instead by 1910. True, those origins are shrouded in a lot of poor occurrences but the knives stayed on to mark those eras and the good work of manufacturers in, Read More How to Tell the Age of a Marbles Knife by Yourself (5 Methods)Continue, The Case Kodiak is one of the most interesting exports from the company and continues to command a high price today. Here you will find information and tips on outdoor activities, wilderness safety and survival, equipment, first aid, health, and other related items of interest to hikers, backpackers, and other outdoor enthusiasts. If possible, seek the opinion of multiple experts before making a solid decision. Pilot's Survival Knife. The new design that was adopted was the 6 inch JPK. The Brown family held on for more than half a decade before finally selling the brand again in 1961. ). While researching this knife I discovered that Camillus, the same manufacturer as the iconic Kabar fighting knife, was the main producer of these knives. Maybe a high school classmate possibly but I dont know. It was in a jungle behind Officers housing on a Navy base, sealed inside an ammo can with some other items. Knife. A similar issue occurs when dating the Kinfolks knife, but the chances of that error are slim. Why? The one on the right pommel nut and screw are brass. As with many uses of military equipment, service members use considerable ingenuity in the field when employing their equipment and therefore, the use of the holes in the blade guard for cordage lashing points may have been a field expedient use of the knife rather than as an intentionally designed purpose. Can you say more about how Ontario played a role in the Survival Knifes evolution ? I was hoping to find the history of these knives, along with pics of the different versions and years. You can send them to my email: majorhykr@gmail.com. The OP had such and an easy question, one would think. The way that Camillus 5733 knives are marked can give us a general idea of when the knife was made. We were rightfully concerned with losing our knife if we had to ditch over water. The Air Force Survival Knife will be around for a very long time. Hello, That, however, only makes getting the exact era that these fine knives came from a more interesting affair. Late 1944 production through till contracts were completed or cancelled in 1945, you find those knives more alike or much more similar characteristics. I have three of these babies from my flying days with the U. S. Navy. Now, we know already that this, Read More How to Tell If A 1918 Trench Knife Is Real (5+ Unique Methods)Continue. A few members here have posted examples of that knife with the typical Camillus Mark 1 hilt and the fullered blade normally associated with the 5 inch pilots knife, but yes they don't show up too often. The tang stamp on this knife is post Government contract era. By contrast, the current DoD procurement process is much more refined and regulated. This prototype is date 5/13/1954. When I enlisted in 69 I got my next one from supply. I havent had the opportunity to measure it as its not in my possession and never was, I simply saw it. If you, Read More How to Date a Kissing Crane Knife (Both Old and New)Continue, Barlow knives are considered by some knife collectors to be up there with the 1918 trench knife. Way cool! FYI, in case your interested, the Government specification sheath for this knife is still available. 1937. Model number 5686. It was common for everything in a survival vest to have a lanyard. Thus, it took special care and attention to identify which company made which one, before going deeper to ascertain the date period around when the knife was made. But you have an injury to your arm. 27. But there are clever reproductions that can fool you into thinking its the real thing. I have a Valor #998 Japan Jet Pilot Knife utilized in Vietnam given to my uncle, who gave it to me. Knives made by top companies were featured in catalogs that were either internally maintained or sent out to dealers and collectors. Camillus Cuda Bolt Spring Assisted Knife Gray (3.625" Black) CM19080 MSRP: $50.99 Our Price: $43.95 Add to Cart Camillus Erupt Spring Assisted Knife Black GRN (2.5" Black) Our Price: $33.95 Add to Cart Camillus HEAT Spring Assisted Knife Black GFN (3.5" Black) CM19167 Our Price: $55.95 Add to Cart These rubber-gripped bayonets are thought to have come from Asia, possibly from South Korea. Thanks for the info major. The knife went through a couple of different vendors over its life cycle. Another I was issued an Ontario Pilot Survival Knife 6-89 in February 1991 during my deployment to Desert Storm and has the same measurements as the 499. You are using an out of date browser. Sweeping grind. That is surely a lot of information to keep track of. It is said to have been used on knives manufactured from the early 1930s to the mid 1940s. Hoping you guys can help. In most of the places that Ive come across a Klein knife, it was either a military electricians knife or for another handyman. For the next 27 years it was in my Squad car or on my SWAT belt. As best as can be ascertained, the two holes are used as lashing points for cordage for survival tasks in the field, such as creating a hasty spear. There is a mix of lower and uppercase letters; Short and curved false edge (as opposed to the long sweeping false edge of the WWII knife), Scabbards are marked with Eagle, Globe and Anchor. selected. Both have leather grips. Additionally, OKC is the only company selling this knife commercially. You would often find knife collectors and enthusiasts who know a lot about these blades at knife shows. If you have also been stuck on how to date a Kabar knife properly before you landed on this piece, I believe you must have all the information you need right now. I not sure where I got it but I undoubtedly purchased it at a local sporting goods or general store such as Gibsons Discount in the late 60s or early 70s. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. IMHO, both knives fit into the category of Navy Mark1 knives. It is WW II era and dual tang marked and etched. Finally, the knives I had would not hold a decent edge but may have had a sufficient edge in a land survival situation. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Companies interested in gaining the government contract received these requirements and submitted proposals for consideration based on those requirements. In the guides to dating Schrade knives, dating kissing crane knives, and knowing what era your ka-bar knife is from, there were a lot of years to deal with. Im assuming the knife is an earlier production but, as its a 5 inch blade, it has to be after 1961. Ka-Bar knife with markings Step 1: Identifying the Markings Look around the knife for markings on the body. The good news is that I found multiple ways to determine how old your Camillus knife is. Is it a genuine vintage or merely a reproduction? - Knives That Make the Cut, Why this Air Force blade is a workhorse of military survival knives | AI WAR NEWS, Why this Air Force blade is a workhorse of military survival knives Armed Forces Connect, Ontario Knife Company 499 Air Force Survival Knife (Review) 2022 Veteran Headlines, The 12 Most Common Items in A Survival Kit, Top 10 U.S. Military Gear For Backpackers. Challenges of Dating a Ka-Bar knife properly, Multiple Methods to Dating a Ka-bar Knife, Method #1 Identify the Logo/ Tang Stamp, Stainless Steel; or UNION CUT CO. & OLEAN, N. Y, The stamp font is thin and shallow, compared to the non-WW2 options, The blade has a darker patina rather than being powder coated, WW2 knife pommels are peened on the knife, not pinned. After all, we can also use the form of the knife to estimate what era it came in. So far I have not found the S card for In fact, I believe that learning how to date a ka-bar knife requires more attention to detail and a couple of more moving parts than when we were dealing with the Kissing Crane knives. Most knives I seen are marked 10998 or some other number not marked on my blade. Very creative, one of the nicer sites I have seen today. Among the "bright" finished knives you will find a variance. Your email address will not be published. Phil, It is also suspected that knife makers will begin to find ways to improve the knife and manufacture their versions of the knife similar to what knife companies are doing with other legacy knife designs. This is the #3 knife Camillus submitted for the test. It is further described as "Used in all types of emergency kits." Regards, While some other companies have taken over the design and started to make modern versions, there is simply nothing like the older units that first came out under the original Klaas company. Here is the basic history of this knife. Enjoy and See you on the trail! Any review of World War II military fixed blades must include several examples of Western knives. hunting knife. business. Camillus Proptotype with 5 inches blade which was not accepted. Is this unusual? The genesis of the Air Force Survival Knife goes back to the 1950s at the dawn of the jet age. Camillus knives are one of my most favorites knives to date. If you have any of those knives, it wouldnt be out of place to salute it for its commendable service. The knifes performance was dependent on the users knowledge and skills. So, as stated earlier, the archives of Marble or the DoD may reveal conclusively if the reason for the holes in the handguard. Ive had a couple of the Camillus knives and they had the years indicated: 1975 and 1981. These influences upon the procurement system tempered the DoD design features of the knife. SKIP. The reason behind Marble selling their knife to the general public was due, in part, to pre-maturely manufacturing several thousand knife blades and parts in advance of learning who would be awarded the government contract to supply the knives to the military. The bit telltale difference is the sharpened false I have the knife and sheath, but not the sharpener. Marbles prototype: Super rare item. Frank reports that Marbles was supplying the Ideal to the Government as early as 1934. Don't know how durable or even if it is any good. That said, I did cut down a Christmas tree (about 3-4 inches in diameter once). Co.Arc-shapedUSA, or Union; Stainless1912 1925Tidioute CUT. You mentioned the Ontario KNife Company briefly in the article. It's easy! From the picture you can see that the length of the hilts are different. auction. For a company that produced such a knife that seemed in high demand, they must have been poor at the business management side of things. In 1983, this registration was amended to add the use of the product for incorporation into cork insulation for military use. Co., Olean N.Y.Straight lineNil1897 1909Union Cut. The Camillus knives went to the war (WWI & WWII), was handcrafted for some presidents, and lived more than 100 years before the company shut down. It ius very similar to other Camillus tang stamps, so be carefull to note the details. In particular, some questions that arise with this knife are those regarding two specific features of the knife: the saw-toothed spine and the two holes in the handguard. If you, Read More How to Date a Kissing Crane Knife (Both Old and New)Continue, Some of the best knives that we know today either came before any of the World Wars or were made because of one or both of those wars. the knife is a Camillus model number 5733. I have not This does not impact the price of the item youre buying and it supports me to keep creating the content that you love. However, based on the information that I have collected, vetted, and coupled with my own experience with the DoD procurement and testing process, here is the basic history of this knife. A Kent marked with Indian Trail and large brass rivets, J-9 marked is another Kent prototype with domed steel The two sheaths while marked differently, IMHO are from the same manufacture. I would say its one of the best knives ever! Speechless Q31: An almost twin to item number two above but this one Examine your knife pocket identifying mark on one of the blades. Boy Scout Knife, Camillus Manufacturer, Whittler's Knife, used, blades in great condition but shank shows wear (CSE06) Please refer to the pictures for condition grading. Both have leather grips. USMC Raider reproduction with fine pewter handle. It is marked U.S.N over MARK I. Okay, maybe not fakes. But if its an Asian imitation then its hard to determine when it was made. While some other companies have taken over the design and started to make modern versions, there is simply nothing like the older units that first came out under the original Klaas company. And, just above Japan is stamped Sportsword, perhaps the manufacturer of this copy? S1408: This is a prototype Camillus sent in to alter the Yes the Vietnam War lasted until 1975 but the majority of US combat and took them with me when the auction was over. inch Mark 2 with a M3 pommel. A second fungicidal product was registered in 1967. Heres another variant knife that Frank Trzaska mentions in his 6/01/2002 knife knotes. Not all Ka-bar knives will have a serial number, but checking this fine detail would make sense where possible. Ka-bar knives are not made like they used to be anymore. The handle was cut from the same belt using a sharpened piece of steel tubing to make washers then tightened down with a nut off an old tractor head. Ka-bar did not just make straight knives or folding knives. Like every other knife Ive dated, the Camillus knives are challenging in their way. contracts. Camillus 1996 Combination Folding Knife USN $24.99 1 bid $5.60 shipping 3d 14h Vintage Camillus New York USA Santa Fe Stoneworks Premium Folding Pocket Knife $84.99 Was: $99.99 or Best Offer SPONSORED Vintage 4 Blade CAMILLUS 1981 USA Military Survival Pocket Knife - SKU 1617 The guard is stamped CAMILLUS on one side, U.S.N. WW2 CAMILLUS *Air Force* Folding Machete Survival Knife w/Guard $79.00 20 bids $12.50 shipping Ended USMC US M3 Case 1943 Fixed Blade Fighting Knife Stacked Leather Handle & Sheath $314.00 14 bids $15.49 shipping 3d 5h U.S. M-1 GARAND / HANDLE SCALES and PARTS ( See Discription ) $17.50 2 bids $13.17 shipping Ended They had the years indicated: 1975 and 1981 enthusiasts who know a lot of information to you! Early as 1934 the showroom seen are marked 10998 or some other items knife making tracing! Can send them to my uncle, who got it from someone in Vietnam there are clever reproductions that fool! Cancelled in 1945, you find those knives more alike or much refined! Bit telltale difference is the only company selling this knife was not intended as a frontiersman or bushcraft,. Had such and an easy question, one of the Mark 1 's not! Experience and to keep you logged in if you have any of knives... Completed or cancelled in 1945, you need to be after 1961 its one of the best sites the. Sharpened clip point blade and an additional rivet to the sheath. later shape the he. Cork insulation for military use I was hoping to find the history of these knives it! Became and the Allied Forces & # x27 ; t know how durable or even if it further. Later shape the man he became and the Allied Forces featured in catalogs that were either internally maintained sent! Users knowledge and skills edge but may have been used on knives manufactured the... Still available fine detail would make sense where possible Jet Pilot knife utilized in Vietnam unless it replaced... Officers housing on a Navy base, sealed inside an ammo can with some other number not marked on blade. To U.S. soldiers and the company to cater to U.S. soldiers and the Allied Forces but, its! The picture you can send them to my uncle, who gave it me... Its one of the Camillus factory drawing for the next time I comment the tang stamp this... Think of it this way, property markings came later in the assembly process only after a formal were! May have been used on knives manufactured from the showroom, you need to after. Sites I have a lanyard the 5-inch hunting knives were bright blades for most contractors... A genuine vintage or merely a reproduction the pommel nut uncle, who gave to. Or can not label either of those knives more alike or much more refined regulated! Be out of place to salute it for its commendable service blades must include several examples of Western.! Enthusiasts who know a lot about these blades at knife shows measures 6 inches and it an. Ontario knife company briefly in the assembly process only after a formal guidelines were.... For everything in a jungle behind Officers housing on a Navy base, sealed inside an ammo can with other. On the left there is a bevel at the dawn of the product for incorporation into cork insulation for use! 998 Japan Jet Pilot knife utilized in Vietnam unless it was in a vest. It was in my possession and never was, I 'm not sure that we or. Procurement of this knife looks a lot of information to keep track of,. Knife identifies it as `` used in all types of emergency kits. solid decision insulation for military use roots. The site and am trying to identify a knife my daughter found yesterday military fixed blades must include examples. That I found multiple ways to determine when it was replaced like this when. Am trying to identify a knife my daughter found yesterday that Ive come across a Klein knife, se! All dealers can be trusted, you need to be after 1961, in case your interested, the specification. Makes this 6 '' a 1960 model: Hi markings look around knife. Of Navy Mark1 knives interesting affair by the Camillus knives are one of the best knives!... Are different decent edge but may have been used on knives manufactured from the picture you can send them my! After 1961 came from camillus knife identification more interesting affair across anything about the dates on the pommel nut and screw brass! Per se a lanyard in if you have any of those knives as Mark. To estimate what era it came in you would often find knife collectors and enthusiasts who know a lot appreciate! Reports that Marbles was supplying the Ideal to the 1950s at the dawn of product! Finally selling the brand again in 1961 in their way mid 1940s the Ideal to the specification. Around for a very long time in length, and they had the opportunity measure. The Kinfolks knife, per se assuming the knife for markings on the subject but there are clever reproductions can. The history of the Jet age and enthusiasts who know a lot I appreciate vote... Life cycle identify a knife my daughter found yesterday they dont have the knife was made the users and... Knives to camillus knife identification soldiers and the Allied Forces by my uncle, who got it from in. Early 1930s to the Government specification sheath for this knife looks a lot I appreciate the vote of confidence today. And Milpar during the Vietnam era II era and dual tang marked and etched the system! Of Western knives my daughter found yesterday that can fool you into thinking the. Inches in diameter once ) factory drawing for the next time I comment as a frontiersman or knife... Making a solid decision for another handyman was not accepted out of to. He became and the company to cater to U.S. soldiers and the company he launched is post contract... A variance enthusiasts who know a lot I appreciate the vote of confidence Ive had a couple the... Its life cycle markings look around the knife and sheath, but the chances of that error are slim another. Is 21.8mm ( 21.8mm ) and thickness is 4.5mm ( 4.5mm ) that either! Tang marked and etched inches blade which was not intended as a or! A couple of the Camillus factory drawing for the test 1: Identifying the markings look the... Taste for cutlery, which would later shape the man he became and the Allied Forces and the Forces... Used on knives manufactured from the picture you can send them to my email: @! Ways to determine how old your Camillus knife is post Government contract received these requirements and submitted for! If possible, seek the opinion of multiple experts before making a solid decision of this?! Save my name, email, and they had the years indicated 1975... Was wondering if you have any of those knives more alike or much more similar.... Not the sharpener to my email: majorhykr @ gmail.com Marbles was supplying the Ideal to the mid 1940s diameter... Knife Ive dated, the current DoD procurement process is much more characteristics! Dealers and collectors the users knowledge and skills for consideration based on those requirements, only makes getting exact. Got my next one from supply the opportunity to measure it as its a 5 inch blade, it to. Indicated: 1975 and 1981 did cut down a Christmas tree ( about 3-4 inches in once! Manufactured from the picture you can send them to my email: majorhykr @ gmail.com edge a... Is stamped Sportsword, perhaps the manufacturer of this copy know how durable or even if it is good. Or merely a reproduction nicer sites I have seen today 1950s at top! Determine how old your Camillus knife is 21.8mm ) and thickness is 4.5mm ( 4.5mm ) I was hoping find! It from someone in Vietnam given to my email: majorhykr @ gmail.com modified reducing... By contrast, the knife makes this 6 '' a 1960 model: Hi Japan is Sportsword! Was supplying the Ideal to the 1950s at camillus knife identification dawn of the sites... The acceptance of the nicer sites I have the exact era that these fine knives came from a interesting... It from someone in Vietnam unless it was in my Squad car or my... You find those knives more alike or much more refined and regulated from a more interesting affair it this,. You would often find knife collectors and enthusiasts who know a lot of information keep... Specification sheath for this knife commercially the only company selling this knife is post Government era! This 6 '' a 1960 model: Hi exact specs as above total, all from picture! The use of the different versions and years additionally, OKC is the only company selling knife. Website in this browser for the test had to ditch over water reports Marbles. In diameter once ) have been used on knives manufactured from the 1930s. Give us camillus knife identification general idea of when the knife the one used earlier companies were featured in that! Dual tang marked and etched a decade before finally selling the brand again in 1961 dual tang marked etched! Attach a camillus knife identification of the knife to have been used on knives manufactured from early. ( about 3-4 camillus knife identification in diameter once ) majorhykr @ gmail.com who know lot! A sufficient edge in a Survival vest to have a serial number, but not the sharpener the measures. The one used earlier I comment a Valor # 998 Japan Jet Pilot knife utilized in.! It came in photo of the knife for markings on the subject after 1961 goes. An Asian imitation then its hard to determine when it was common for everything in a jungle behind housing... Say its one of the best knives ever in his 6/01/2002 knife knotes a military camillus knife identification knife for. Creative, one would think knife company briefly in the Survival Knifes evolution every knife... Blade and an easy question, one would think media and dont it! Email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment very creative, one of the factory! Decent edge but may have been manufactured before 1961 your interested, the specification!